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Forum Index: DISCUSSION: Dock Talk:
Lightning Retro for junior sailing
Team McLube

 



Bruce Thompson
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Aug 5, 2009, 10:23 AM

Post #1 of 3 (2848 views)
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Lightning Retro for junior sailing Log-In to Post/Reply

Back in the 1960’s, Larchmont Race Week would host huge fleets of Lightnings and Blue Jays sailed by juniors. Today’s Lightning Class is very supportive of junior sailing, particularly through efforts such as the Sears Cup and the Grant Program. But the numbers of juniors who have their own Lightnings is tiny compared to the glory days. That has led to a study to determine a way to draw even more kids to the class.

Here at Fleet 5 in Chicago, we have been discussing a plan to re-introduce a Lightning more like the original Olin Stephens design we call the Lightning Retro. It detunes some of the innovations our fleet members worked on to turbocharge the original Lightning to make it more competitive with more modern designs, in the process making it more powerful and harder for kids to handle. Our fleet members, Bruce ‘The Bruin’ Goldsmith and Bob ‘Fast Boats Sail in Hot Water’ Smither, were instrumental in the decksweeper jib and oval mast revolutions. Their ideas have kept a 71 year old design current. But both also loved the class’ family appeal. We want to have both, the hotrod and the junior boat. So we're looking at two versions of a great design.

To take a page from the Laser book (ie, Laser, Laser Radial, and Laser 4.7), we are looking at various ways to de-power the rig without changing anything else. The original plans show a jib with a high foot and reef points on the main. Hiking straps and tiller extensions were way out in the future. So the plan is to take the current sail design and cut the sails down to create a smaller sail plan. We would also allow a cut down spinnaker, about the size of a Thistle spinnaker. This allows a kid to buy an old boat and sails and with minimal investment have a legal Lightning Retro. But he could also invest some sweat equity and buy new sails and move up to the full rig as he/she matures. What other class has five generations of the same family sailing the same boat?

The economics of becoming a lifelong Lightning sailor are very attractive. Click here for a link to the current classified ads for boats.

You will find everything from a new boat 15363 for $17,000 to a 15 year old boat 14652 for $8500 to a 70 year old boat 2777 for $2500. Obviously, the resale value holds up quite well. Amortized over a lifetime of Lightning sailing, the initial cost is quite modest. Which means you can buy a boat like 14652, sail it for a few years and re-sell it at about what you paid for it. Then you can buy 15363 as your improved financial position would then allow. With over 15,000 boats built, there is a boat for every budget.

The progression up the age ladder would look like this:

Starter boat - Retro main only, board partially retracted to give good balance to the helm.

Intermediate - Retro main and jib only (this would also be the collegiate dinghy version)

Advanced - Retro main, jib and spinnaker (this would be the collegiate women’s sloop version)

International - The full rig (the collegiate open sloop version)

As you can see, we have considered the needs of collegiate sailors. The class has an amazing history of being a launching pad for famous women sailors, with names like Shore, Allen, Palmer, Allison, Swett & Swanson. With a de-powered rig, it now would have the ability to accommodate a new event, the three women collegiate women’s sloop, a very suitable use for all those colleges looking for a place to spend their Title IX funds! With the full rig, it could also do open (men & women) sloop racing. That de-powered boat which earns its keep being used for sailing classes during the week can simply change dresses and be a Cinderella racer on weekends!

We’d like to hear what people think of our ideas.

Bruce Thompson


tprice
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Aug 25, 2009, 1:50 PM

Post #2 of 3 (2497 views)
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Re: [Bruce Thompson] Lightning Retro for junior sailing [In reply to] Log-In to Post/Reply

For starters, change rudder to a more balanced one to make the helm feel lighter. Being overpowered has a lot to do with the feel on the helm. A less L shaped rudder would help with that.
TP


Bruce Thompson
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Nov 11, 2009, 1:33 PM

Post #3 of 3 (2169 views)
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Re: [Bruce Thompson] Lightning Retro for junior sailing [In reply to] Log-In to Post/Reply

Here are more thoughts on this subject as taken from an e-mail I recently sent to my cousin

Hi Bob, In my previous e-mail I assumed that you were asking about R-19s etc with regard to spending your own money & that of young people on a tight budget. If I were to offer ideas to the advisor to a large state university on where to spend its money. I would be more extravagant!! Assuming you have a big enough lake, I'd suggest something along the lines of what we were discussing here in Chicago when I came up with my Lightning Retro idea. The complaint was from a girl at Michigan State (via her boyfriend) that there were very limited opportunities to sail for women at MSU. Since MSU sails on Lake Lansing and Lake Lansing is home to the Lansing Sailing Club, home to a Lightning Fleet, it struck me that we ought to try to direct the MSU women there. The problem is that the Lightning has become too powerful for light crews to handle in stronger breezes. This report from Ireland documents the changes that have taken place over the last 65 years http://www.lightningclass.org/...y/killyleagh65th.pdf You'll see that back long ago the boat had flatter sails (no broadseaming of the panels - Lowell North's idea) and no decksweeper jib (Bruce Goldsmith's idea) and no adjustable backstay (Bob Smither's idea). It also had reef points in the main. The basic premise of the Lightning Retro is to make it possible to reduce the size of the sailplan, without changing anything about the boat itself, to make a modern Lightning about the same power as it was back in the Sixties. Back then, there were over 150 Lightnings sailed by teenagers, many of them girls, that would sail together in Larchmont Race Week on Long Island Sound. By simply changing to the full sail plan, you have a fully modern racing boat sailed competitively worldwide. Note that at the CofC all three boats that got podium finishes had male/female teams as part of the crew. Tom & Jody Starck, Dan & Tobi Moriarty and Allan & Katie Terhune specifically. There were several other husband/wife teams including Jeff & Amy Linton (the 2007 Rolex Yachtsman of the Year), Talbott & Carol Lee Ingram (plus their son Tal Ingram), Mike & Stephanie Martin (2009 505 World Champion) & Todd & Kristine Wake (Secretary of Sail Sheboygan, the home of the U S Sailing Match Racing Center). So sailing is indeed a lifelong, family sport even at its highest levels of competition. I would also note that the Lightning is a Pan American Games class, so sailing one is definitely a SPORT. So the simple idea is to have universities spend their Title IX money on a women's sport, specifically Lightning Retro racing! If you bought a fleet under the fleet development program http://www.lightningclass.org/...opmentinitiative.asp You would be in a position to host both an Intercollegiate Women's Sloop Championship, and then switch sails to the full rig and do it again for coed teams! See? It's really easy to spend other people's money!!


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